Pete's Place

[Begemot]

Good stuff here Pete. Your scenario looks perfect as an introduction to Mein Panzer. We know your tanks are superb, but the real star here is your desert terrain. Put a few saguaro on the board and this old desert rat will feel right at home.


Begemot

[pmskaar]

Thank you very much, Begemot! I try to tailor the scenario so that it is interesting for both sides and easy to get into the action. I designed this one with those thoughts in mind.

[redleg]

Very awesome Pete! Next time you run a game I need to take a little road trip!

[pmskaar]

Thanks very much, Redleg! I would be happy to have you come and play any time you want.

I ran the game last Saturday, October 21st and had 4 players. They had a fun time and are interested in playing again. Three out of the 4 were new to the game. The 4th player had not played in a while. I will post a couple pictures here soon.

[pmskaar]

Here are a couple pictures from the Mein Panzer game I ran last Saturday, October 21st. We had 4 people to play including 3 new to the game and the 4th who had not played for a while. I took on hosting duties.

We played through 3 turns of Cruisin' for a Bruisin' in about 90 minutes of actual play. A couple of the guys had to be elsewhere at certain times so had to cut the game a bit short. Still, the guys did get to use the basic mechanics of moving and shooting and had fun. They say they would like to do it again so I consider the game as a success.

For those that are interested, the Germans won the game by seizing the crossroads in the village but nobody got blown away in the short time we played.

Here are a couple pictures.

[redleg]

I'm super jealous Pete! I want to play! Looks like a great game!

[pmskaar]

Thanks very much, Redleg! I plan to run another game in January. It may be the same basic scenario but I have at least 2 or 3 players that plan to be back for more.

[Hoth_902]

Pete,

Gorgeous terrain and thanks for the pictures. On a slightly different note, with black Friday, I have some more WWII German purchases planned. As a result, I find myself coming back to the well, once again, do dip my empty bucket into the cool waters of knowledge that is your tread. My question is as follows..

I know there were PZIIs still operating in 1943. Would these vehicles still been in the Panzer Grey color and mixed in with other vehicles that were painted in Dark Yellow, or would they have been left in Panzer Grey. As we spoke before, anything coming from or intended for North Africa would have or could have been panted in Dark Yellow.. so I could imagine some of them having a dark yellow scheme. Is this possible that a PZII would have a dark yellow scheme and camo to go with? Would this be the same for the PZIV short barrel? What does the OG of 285th have to say.

By the way, just primed up A bunch of PZIIIs and stugs.. Kampfgruppen Hoth_902 is growing. Got inspired and actually got some painting done.

[pmskaar]

Thank you very much Hoth!

Here is what I know about German tank colors in this transition period 1942-43.

In February 1943, the new the base color of Dunkelgelb aka Dark Yellow was introduced as the official color for vehicles and much of the equipment in the German Army. This color officially replaced Dark Gray aka Panzer Gray.

Although this happened in 1943, you can see pictures of some German vehicles in 1942 painted in camouflage such as green or sand over the gray in blotches or stripes to help make them blend in a bit. Even mud was applied to lighten the vehicles up a bit when it dried.

Once the official change occurred, all vehicles were to be repainted in the new Dunkelgelb color as supplies and time permitted including vehicles still in service. I think that by July 1943, at the start of the Battle of Kursk, this had been mostly accomplished. There might be a few exceptions for whatever reason but they would be increasingly rare as the war went on.

Any older vehicles already in service would have received the new color over the older gray color. That means any Panzer IIs, IIIs, IVs, VIs, already in service would get repainted. In 1943, Panzer IIs were now being phased out and the surviving tanks were in the regimental or maybe battalion level but, in general, the line companies were no longer using them. Any older model tanks that still survived would have been repainted including short barrelled Mk IVs which were increasingly rare.

The camouflage painting was done in the field. Each unit was given a supply of paint. The colors were supposed to be applied with paint thinner and sprayed on but that did not always happen. I have heard you could even thin the paints with water but they were not as durable if this was used and tended to fade out. As you can imagine, there were no real standard patterns at this time so you will see a mixture of spots, blotches, stripes etc. in various patterns and sizes.

My recommendation is to look at particular vehicles in particular units to get an idea of the patterns you want to use. For my Elephants, I used a particular pattern except for 1 that I used the "Kursk" pattern that sort of looks like a web of green over the dark yellow. For my Panzer IIIs at the time of Kursk, I roughly modeled these on 6th Panzer. You have lots of latitude on this.

As far as I know, the vehicles that were in North Africa were painted in either RAL 8000 from 1941 until about March 1942 or RAL 8020 which was used from March 1942 until the end in Tunisia.

More later

[pmskaar]

Here are a few examples of German vehicle camouflage from 1943-45. There are lots of varieties of camo and I have done a fair number of the basic ones.



Elephants including a "Kursk" scheme that at least some Ferdinands sported at Kursk.



Marder IIs with large green blotches. I saw this scheme on the Tamiya kit but also some other photos as well.



StuG IIIGs and a couple StuH 42s in the back. A variety of patterns here.



A variety of German softskins in a variety of camouflage patterns.

More coming later

[redleg]

Your vehicles look amazing Pete!

[Hoth_902]

Pete,
Once again, thanks for the good info. I am going to go ahead and paint my PZIV short barrels Dark Yellow. Might just keep them Uni-color. Then I am going to Buy about company worth of late model PZIIs. I have seen where some units still had a few, sometimes in command units or recon... Might be fun to mix in two or three in a unit or tow. Last hold outs before the unit gets new kit. As for the scheme, I am going to take your advice and look for a particular unit's scheme and use it as a basis.. I have seen quite a few tanks with Dark Yellow and Panzer Grey.. Its always intregied me and I might do a few vehicles up with that scheme.. I think its been typically an SS Unit. I will have to find a picture once I am done working.. Post later if I find it.

[Hoth_902]

Pete,

Found the image I was looking at. see below. Its the one in the middle on the left side. Always thought it was a neat scheme. Does not seem practical for being in nature, but like it..

[pmskaar]

Thanks very much, Redleg and Hoth! I appreciate it.

Hoth, in mid 1943 I think that any surviving Panzer IIs were now at the Battalion and Regimental level. Any older Panzer IIIs and IVs would be used by the line units. Many older vehicles were also incorporated into training units and often these did not have camo. Later in the war, some of these tanks at least, were pulled back out of training units and back into the front lines.

I like the StuG III camouflage charts that you provided. It just shows that the Germans had a great variety of camo patterns throughout the latter part of WWII.

[Hoth_902]

Pete,

I definitely read the same thing as I slowly dig into Panzertruppen 2. As I build my WWII units, I will probably have enough to field a full Regiment 1 for 1. Being the engineer that I am, it then drives me to want to build the regimental HQ units even if they would have limited use in a game... I also could see a fun scenario where the Russians break through and engage the Regimental HQ though I understand that would have been rare.. At the end of the day, they would be more for completeness. That is why I thought about just painting in Panzer Grey so that they could be used both in early war battles and as security for a regimental HQ.

Agreed on how interesting it is to see all the varying schemes that the Germans used. I really like finding unique schemes and painting them up so my stuff stands out on a table.. When they actually get into a game which has been rare to non existent. I think this adds variety to things.

On a slightly different note, how many coats of base color do you put on your vehicles when you airbrush? I put 1 coat of primer and two coats of base color. At some point I will seal them.. though I have never done that yet.. Do you seal yours?