It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

This is a general forum for all types of posts related to Military models.

Moderators: dnichols, GHQ, Mk 1

Bikemancs
Posts: 9
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2021 7:48 pm
Location: Ft. Bragg, NC

It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by Bikemancs »

Good morning all.

I just put in my first big order in with GHQ. I've actually been looking for a solution to visually demonstrate the size of Army formations for years. I started with hot wheels/matchbox, but inability to find certain vehicles and it quickly became very expensive. I have experimented with 3D printing, but just never found the right model. I got turned on to GHQ a few weeks ago, ordered a sampler pack, and I'm sold. This will be my first attempt at building a specific unit under my HQ.

Unfortunately there's a few vehicles/items I can't quite buy off the shelf (or haven't found), and I'm wondering how others may have solved this. Specifically:
1. SATS Trailers
2. MTCRS
3. Containers / CROPs / Flat Racks. (I found a small container but I need 16-20')
4. Contact Trucks (HMMWVs w/Toolbox)
5. Forklifts/MHE
6. Trailers like the M872. (I figure I can cut a bed off a MTV to make a M1088)
7. Water Buffalo's and their eventual HIPPO replacement.

I figure I can do some of the containers via 3D printing, but I know some of these others, I don't have the skill in 3D software yet, and/or the smaller capabilities on my Ender.

And yes, if you didn't guess, I'm building a Forward Support Company, under current MTOE.

panzergator
E5
Posts: 3328
Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2015 3:44 am

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by panzergator »

Try Shapeways. Expensive, but good selection of the more esoteric. Check bottom of page to make sure you have 51 pages to look at.
All blessings flow from a good mission statement.
Pogo was right. So was Ike.
"A Gentleman is a man who is only rude intentionally." (Churchill)
Give credit. Take responsibility.

redleg
E5
Posts: 3396
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 11:02 am
Location: Riverside, CA

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by redleg »

Welcome aboard, and sorry to hear about your addiction! Maybe you don't realize you're addicted to micro armor yet. It doesn't take long!

One of the great things about this forum is that the members are such a fantastic resource. A dude named Brigade Commander is doing the same thing and I recall he has found a lot of the more random vehicles for his FSB - maybe shoot him a PM and see where he is getting his stuff. I think he mentioned Shapeways as well, but not 100% sure.

Are you building a specific unit? Tell us more!
Redleg's Website: micropope.webstarts.com

Cav Dog
E5
Posts: 876
Joined: Wed Dec 29, 2004 1:12 am

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by Cav Dog »

A close enough version of the water buffalo is in US58 in WWII listings. It is the WWII version and listed as a POL trailer but honestly I don't think they are all that different and didn't change that much until recently.
Tactics are the opinion of the senior officer present.

Brigade Commander
E5
Posts: 451
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 2:26 am

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by Brigade Commander »

Bikemancs wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 8:20 pm
Good morning all.

I just put in my first big order in with GHQ. I've actually been looking for a solution to visually demonstrate the size of Army formations for years. I started with hot wheels/matchbox, but inability to find certain vehicles and it quickly became very expensive. I have experimented with 3D printing, but just never found the right model. I got turned on to GHQ a few weeks ago, ordered a sampler pack, and I'm sold. This will be my first attempt at building a specific unit under my HQ.

Unfortunately there's a few vehicles/items I can't quite buy off the shelf (or haven't found), and I'm wondering how others may have solved this. Specifically:
1. SATS Trailers
2. MTCRS
3. Containers / CROPs / Flat Racks. (I found a small container but I need 16-20')
4. Contact Trucks (HMMWVs w/Toolbox)
5. Forklifts/MHE
6. Trailers like the M872. (I figure I can cut a bed off a MTV to make a M1088)
7. Water Buffalo's and their eventual HIPPO replacement.

I figure I can do some of the containers via 3D printing, but I know some of these others, I don't have the skill in 3D software yet, and/or the smaller capabilities on my Ender.

And yes, if you didn't guess, I'm building a Forward Support Company, under current MTOE.
Welcome aboard indeed Bikemancs. I get a bit of abuse for my OCD about modeling whole units. Actually, I believe everyone is just jealous that I can spell Logistics! But hey I just cannot bring myself to send line companies out without being fed and watered! Not to mention oil changes, flat tire repairs, etc. Plus you need to have a Medic or two around in case someone stubs their toe or something.

So some background. I am modeling the 3rd Brigade of the 3rd AD in the 1980's. But I have researched Series-H, Series-J (not enough found) and Series L (AOE). For your time-frame if you do not have it already check out doucments.pub_fksm-71-8-nov-2005.pdf. I believe it was panzergator that pointed me toward this document. Too new for me at some points but works very well at others. Some of what I will cover comes from it. So your list:
1. SATS Trailers - sadly even Shapeways is deficient in trailers. Nothing close. Closest thing might be GHQ N-603 and working with some Evergreen or Plastruct architectural shapes to extend the length and the two-axle trailer from the set?
2. MTCRS - not familiar. Point me toward it and I will keep an eye out as well.
3. Containers / CROPs / Flat Racks. (I found a small container but I need 16-20') - Shapeways is your place to go to for containers & flatracks. Masters of Military have both but I believe only 40' containers. There are 20' containers out there do not despair. For your time period a tractor and a M-872 flatbed with container would be correct although I believe they were pushed up to the COSCOM and out of the division by then and replaced by HEMMT's in the division. Check the actual unit for when the changeover occurred. Not familiar with CROPS.
4. Contact Trucks (HMMWVs w/Toolbox) - Have not seen this but Shapeways has a wide variety, by different designers, of HMMWV variants. If you need an interim model use GHQ's M-1037 (N-80). As you continue your research you will find the HMMWV with shelter being used in more roles.
5. Forklifts/MHE - Someone had a decent Rough Terrain forklift but it is in the raised position and it is not want I want. The plastic Shapeways uses is too brittle to do any kit-bashing with as far as I am concerned so I asked if they would make one in the travel position, perfect on the lowboy, but have received no response.
6. Trailers like the M872. (I figure I can cut a bed off a MTV to make a M1088) My favorite designer on Shapeways, Masters of Military, has the M-872 in both the Breakbulk (my time period - flatbed with side kit) and the straight flatbed with 40' container. Closer to your time period. But see my notes in 3.
7. Water Buffalo's and their eventual HIPPO replacement. By water buffalo's are you referring to the camel 900 gallon water trailer? IF so nothing close that I have seen, see note for item 1, but if you take two water trailers (M-107A2) from the US58 set as Cav Dog pointed out and cut off everything in front of the tank on one and mount it against the end of the other you will come close.

I found that Stefan from Masters of Military can be approached about adding items to their store. I was stuck on the M-969A1 fuel trailer, I had all of the cargo and lowboy variants already made by them but needed fuel. So after searching for documents I finally found drawings / spec sheets sufficient for them to design the trailer and after explaining why I felt it was a win for them I ended up with an email one day saying order away! The SATS trailer and a module for the HIPPO that can be added to GHQ's HEMMT might be items that can be quickly designed and added to their store. They seem straightforward. Let me know what else I might suggest or keep an eye out for. Eventually I will be ordering a full Patriot battalion from Masters of Military.
"It is a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step into the road and, if you do not keep your feet, there is no telling where you might be swept off to."

Bilbo Baggins to Frodo Baggins.

Bikemancs
Posts: 9
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2021 7:48 pm
Location: Ft. Bragg, NC

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by Bikemancs »

Brigade Commander wrote:
Wed Feb 03, 2021 12:58 pm


Welcome aboard indeed Bikemancs. I get a bit of abuse for my OCD about modeling whole units. Actually, I believe everyone is just jealous that I can spell Logistics! But hey I just cannot bring myself to send line companies out without being fed and watered! Not to mention oil changes, flat tire repairs, etc. Plus you need to have a Medic or two around in case someone stubs their toe or something.

So some background. I am modeling the 3rd Brigade of the 3rd AD in the 1980's. But I have researched Series-H, Series-J (not enough found) and Series L (AOE). For your time-frame if you do not have it already check out doucments.pub_fksm-71-8-nov-2005.pdf. I believe it was panzergator that pointed me toward this document. Too new for me at some points but works very well at others. Some of what I will cover comes from it. So your list:
...

I found that Stefan from Masters of Military can be approached about adding items to their store. I was stuck on the M-969A1 fuel trailer, I had all of the cargo and lowboy variants already made by them but needed fuel. So after searching for documents I finally found drawings / spec sheets sufficient for them to design the trailer and after explaining why I felt it was a win for them I ended up with an email one day saying order away! The SATS trailer and a module for the HIPPO that can be added to GHQ's HEMMT might be items that can be quickly designed and added to their store. They seem straightforward. Let me know what else I might suggest or keep an eye out for. Eventually I will be ordering a full Patriot battalion from Masters of Military.
Morning Brigade Commander!

I've seen your work and browsed through it, a bit before my time as I didn't enlist until 03 and commissioned in 07. It does look very good.

Fortunately, when I say for work, I do actually mean that I will use this at work, and I have access to current MTOE. For me, it's dealing with a current project and trying to ensure that we are all visualizing the same equipment and getting others to understand what is in the full package.

1. SATS Trailers - sadly even Shapeways is deficient in trailers. Nothing close. Closest thing might be GHQ N-603 and working with some Evergreen or Plastruct architectural shapes to extend the length and the two-axle trailer from the set? The MTV trailers wheels are too tall, SATS is running on OTR truck tires vs. off road, but I was thinking about shaving down one for the electronics shop... may use it as a base or at least a representative. Might have success in using a WWII trailer as a base and finding a container like thing on top.

2. MTCRS - not familiar. Point me toward it and I will keep an eye out as well. Multi-Temperature Containerized Refrigeration System, aka modular fridge/freezer container (self contained for a LHS to pickup) use to support the Containerized Kitchens (CKs) in current units (well, before the 92Gs got moved to field feeding companies). basically another modular container (self contained loading hook)

3. Containers / CROPs / Flat Racks. (I found a small container but I need 16-20') - Shapeways is your place to go to for containers & flatracks. Masters of Military have both but I believe only 40' containers. There are 20' containers out there do not despair. For your time period a tractor and a M-872 flatbed with container would be correct although I believe they were pushed up to the COSCOM and out of the division by then and replaced by HEMMT's in the division. Check the actual unit for when the changeover occurred. Not familiar with CROPS. Going off the current MTOE, and for the unit, it makes sense they need a flatbed. Not sure if other FSC's are in the same boat. Lots of focus on going to modularity. Army's long run goal is to replace water buffalos and HEMMT Fuelers with modular racks so one LHS/PLS can be multi-role and not rely on a dedicated truck. CROPS is actually the wrong item, but is a flat rack that can go inside a container, while a flat rack holds a container. I was actually trying to think of a CHU (Container Handling Unit) but realize I can probable replicate with some small plastic ad-on or residue from my printer.

4. Contact Trucks (HMMWVs w/Toolbox) - Have not seen this but Shapeways has a wide variety, by different designers, of HMMWV variants. If you need an interim model use GHQ's M-1037 (N-80). As you continue your research you will find the HMMWV with shelter being used in more roles. Found a solution!

5. Forklifts/MHE - Someone had a decent Rough Terrain forklift but it is in the raised position and it is not want I want. The plastic Shapeways uses is too brittle to do any kit-bashing with as far as I am concerned so I asked if they would make one in the travel position, perfect on the lowboy, but have received no response. dang

6. Trailers like the M872. (I figure I can cut a bed off a MTV to make a M1088) My favorite designer on Shapeways, Masters of Military, has the M-872 in both the Breakbulk (my time period - flatbed with side kit) and the straight flatbed with 40' container. Closer to your time period. But see my notes in 3. Current 32' trailers are 2 deck heights, one that's enough to put a tri-con on, and then another that's enough for a 20' plus a tricon or so. most of the 40' straight trailers (with 3x rear axles) have moved out of the units. I only know of 2 that have them, and that may be outdated by now.

7. Water Buffalo's and their eventual HIPPO replacement. By water buffalo's are you referring to the camel 900 gallon water trailer? IF so nothing close that I have seen, see note for item 1, but if you take two water trailers (M-107A2) from the US58 set as Cav Dog pointed out and cut off everything in front of the tank on one and mount it against the end of the other you will come close. Current are 400 or 500, the Hippo is 900 but is a containerized setup for the future. US58 will work with a little modification. Thank you Cav Dog! [/]

Masters of Military actually has some items that with a little work could be converted to what I'm looking for. If I decide it's important enough, I'll reach out. I really appreciate it.

I actually did my last stint in an ADA BDE HQ. Not sure why you want to replicate them, but was an interesting experience with a unit that wasn't my normal type (SUS BDE)

Brigade Commander
E5
Posts: 451
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 2:26 am

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by Brigade Commander »

From your Item-3 above: I recently went to order another batch of M-915 / M-872 cargo units and found that the extra container pack of 5 40' containers was off-line. I already had one set but needed another. I contacted Masters of Military and was told they would check on it. I just received word that the just container pack is back. It is now only four but still usable. I am sure it boiled down to Shapeways getting in its own way again. Not the first time I have had designers tell me Shapeways decided to enforce a change on them even though the product was fine. Sorry, my point for you is that I did ask about 20' containers as well and Masters of Military has two packs of 20' containers added to their store. One is four standard 20' containers and the other is six 20' containers with: 2x 20' bulk-head flat (what the railroad would call it anyway), 2x 20' container made into an office and 2x 20' container frame with a tank mounted. They also have different packs with M-872 flatbed for hauling containers and the M-1120 HEMTT PLS truck.

Now, if I could just get them to add the M-48 Chaparral...
"It is a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. You step into the road and, if you do not keep your feet, there is no telling where you might be swept off to."

Bilbo Baggins to Frodo Baggins.

Bikemancs
Posts: 9
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2021 7:48 pm
Location: Ft. Bragg, NC

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by Bikemancs »

Brigade Commander wrote:
Wed Feb 17, 2021 12:02 pm
From your Item-3 above: I recently went to order another batch of M-915 / M-872 cargo units and found that the extra container pack of 5 40' containers was off-line. I already had one set but needed another. I contacted Masters of Military and was told they would check on it. I just received word that the just container pack is back. It is now only four but still usable. I am sure it boiled down to Shapeways getting in its own way again. Not the first time I have had designers tell me Shapeways decided to enforce a change on them even though the product was fine. Sorry, my point for you is that I did ask about 20' containers as well and Masters of Military has two packs of 20' containers added to their store. One is four standard 20' containers and the other is six 20' containers with: 2x 20' bulk-head flat (what the railroad would call it anyway), 2x 20' container made into an office and 2x 20' container frame with a tank mounted. They also have different packs with M-872 flatbed for hauling containers and the M-1120 HEMTT PLS truck.

Now, if I could just get them to add the M-48 Chaparral...
Nice, I'll have to look those up.

I've got my shapeways and GHQ order.

I think I'm going to experiment with 'flattening' or smoothing the sides of one of the LMTV's cargo beds to see if that creates the "shelter" I'm aiming for there. I do think I got one or two extra packages, but gives me something to experiment with. Just need to find a good layout base (motorpool like) and then get these things painted and operational.

Tanker Mike
Posts: 68
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2004 11:51 pm
Location: Indiana

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by Tanker Mike »

Welcome to the GHQ world!

Like you, I do 1-to-1 except I do German WWII units. Regarding modeling units that are not available,I have had some success with with modding units. For example, before GHQ added generators to the WWII German inventory, I modified WII US Army POL trailers to become WWII German generators using various types of Plastruct.

Mike

Bikemancs
Posts: 9
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2021 7:48 pm
Location: Ft. Bragg, NC

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by Bikemancs »

Well, it's only been two years, but I'm finally getting off my butt on this project. I'm sitting down Friday to cross what I have with an updated MTOE. Some of the things have gone away which reduces my requirements, but I imagine I will be on Shapeways a good bit finding some extras. Containers, forklift and then someway to represent all the generators is on the docket. M1101/M1102 cargo trailers as well.

I am happy to see that the JLTV made it into production here (ordered a couple yesterday). I wouldn't mind seeing the cargo / shelter version. If any assistance is needed there, let me know, I can go look at one and find whatever is publicly available.

I'll be honest, it'd been quite a while since I sat down to do some modeling, and it was very enjoyable this past weekend. Did a lot of assembly and a decent amount of painting. I did start with paint, but realized that assembly was first, so, I have some very interesting looking trucks right now.

The one thing I do need to figure out is a display. As this isn't a "field" display, I basically need a motorpool I can either add some flags to or lettering/signage to provide some details. I was thinking a lego baseplate. But might resort to some 1/4" plywood or something.

redleg
E5
Posts: 3396
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 11:02 am
Location: Riverside, CA

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by redleg »

Are you planning to just build an FSC, or do you think you will keep collecting? I ask because at one point many many many years ago I made a motor pool board that was just a piece of plywood painted gray, but it had all the parking spots laid out for a few batteries. The problem was that I outgrew it real fast, and now I store everything in boxes and I lay units out on special occasions. I my storage boxes I have units on boards that are organized by unit, but they aren't specifically in a motor pool arrangement.

If you do go the motor pool rouite, there is a company called GameCraft Miniatures that makes a motor pool building in 1/285 scale.
Redleg's Website: micropope.webstarts.com

panzergator
E5
Posts: 3328
Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2015 3:44 am

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by panzergator »

Ok, Folks. i like GHQ and heve gotten items from SHAPEWAYS, but you will have to look at 3D printing at some point for these collection items because GHQ is just never going to make some of it.

You must either find a guy to print it or get a 3D printer yoursel and learn to use it. I recommend a resin printer for now. My son has both a resin printer and a filament printer. In terms of print quality, quantity, and print time, the resin printer is, by far, the superior. The M113A1, for instance, is not as good as GHQ's, but good enough. A 54-tank battalion takes 4 hours (2 hours for hulls, 2 hours for turrets, and takes maybe 1/4 of a bottle of resin at $36 a bottle (prices may have changed since our last resin order a year ago).

To see what can be done, go to Yeggi.com and search for "microarmor," "micro armor," "1 285," and other parameters you might come up with.

I also commissioned the XM723, XM800T, and General Motors XM1 stl files from a guy with free and priced models on the yeggi platform. Each file cost about $40, but I can print as many as I want. No distributing, but for personal use.

Maybe not worth it for you, but it is to me, particularly in the quantities I'm looking at. So far, have MBT70s, XM803s, , M113s, M577s, AH56, and AH67 in battalion strength. Son hasn't had printer set up for a year, but soon will. We can't distribute and he really doesn't have time to take orders, but there are people who do. Chris knows a couple.

Check it out.
All blessings flow from a good mission statement.
Pogo was right. So was Ike.
"A Gentleman is a man who is only rude intentionally." (Churchill)
Give credit. Take responsibility.

chrisswim
E5
Posts: 6580
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:22 pm
Location: Jacksonville, FL

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by chrisswim »

Bikemancs,
Here are a few pictures that may help.

Image

In the background are trucks with different conex boxes.

Image

Image

Image

I can take some better photos.
Chris

Bikemancs
Posts: 9
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2021 7:48 pm
Location: Ft. Bragg, NC

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by Bikemancs »

Hey guys,

Thanks for the responses!

That being said, this is actually a work thing, so for right now, just an FSC with another small element. I'm thinking more and more leaning to some plywood or other wood from Lowe's. Just due to the nature that I'm goin to be using it. If I can get it small enough/compact enough, I may look for a display case of some sort.

Roger on Shapeways and a resin printer. I have a Ender, but I don't have it dialed down small enough for this stuff. I've thought about a resin printer. I need to get a few other things straight before I start down that road. Like a good solid area for this to be setup in my house. I agree that the level of detail that I'm looking for will require something more. and I don't expect GHQ to produce everything in the world. I can't imagine what that would look like on the manufacturing side of the house.

Chrisswim, like the pics man. That PLS with the 20' is one thing I think I need to replicate. I do like the IFPC HEMMT you have hiding over there too. That must have been some work.

I do need to figure out how to add some height on some of the MTV/LMTV cargo compartments to replicate shelters.

How do you guys get the trailers to "hook up" to their truck?

chrisswim
E5
Posts: 6580
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:22 pm
Location: Jacksonville, FL

Re: It's work related, I swear (Intro & first post)

Post by chrisswim »

20 ft. containers for you. Will be posting more on Chrisswim Stuff.

Image
Chris

Post Reply