Auxiliaries! I have asked the folks at GHQ for more and would like to know if there is anyone else interested in them as well. I would like to see ships like the following done to round out the options:
USN:
ADs Dobbin, Dixie
AEs Pyro, Shasta
AHs Solace, Haven
AKs C2 Cargo, C3 Cargo, VC Victory, Hog Islander Cargo
CMs Oglala, Terror
AOs Kanawha, Ramapo, Suamico
APs 520' & 535' Presidents, Hog Islander Transport
ARs Medusa, Vestal, Vulcan
AS Holland, Fulton, Pelias
AV Langley, Currituck, Tangier, Bird class
UKN:
ADs Adamant and Maidstone
AKs Canadian Forts
AO 483's
IJN:
AHs Hikawa Maru, Asashi Maru
AKs Aden Maru, Somedono / Ahaya Maru, Lyons / Yone / Tokiwa Maru, Heian Maru
CMs Okinoshima
AMCs Aikoku Maru
AOs Notoro
AR Akashi
AS Rio De Janeiro Maru, Chogei
AVs Kamikawa Maru
GEN:
AMCs well, there are several...Penguin, Komet, Atlantis, Kormoran, Michel, Thor Widder, Orion and Stier The Top killers would be good.
NLN:
AH Op Ten Noort
I know others do some of these listed, but I would like to see GHQ's quality produce them as well.
Let the Merchants and Auxiliaries Sail to support the fleets. From the guy who collects one ship for every ship built or projected, man I hate the number of Libertys launched.
William Compton "Loose lips sink ships" "Kilroy was here!'
WW2 Auxiliaries & Merchants
Moderators: dnichols, GHQ, Mk 1
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IRISH
WW2 Auxiliaries & Merchants
Last edited by IRISH on Mon Jan 22, 2007 7:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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cbovill
- E5
- Posts: 439
- Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2004 5:20 am
- Location: Las Vegas, NV
I for one am very interested in having more auxilliaries and merchants built. I love 'em and can't get enough of 'em. I use them in wargames and I also like to collect them. They add so much flavor to the battle and the collection. Just as I have to have non-combat vehicles and equipment in my armies and the land battles, I need them for the very same reasons in my naval collection.
At the same time I recognize GHQ's limited production capacity vis-a-vis everything we would like produced by them. So I would be pleased if they would allocate some of the resource they have for naval construction to include one or two of these non-combatant types per year - at least until we have some good representation. As it is now, I am very willing to take the Japanese maru and use her as a British AMC, a troop transport for all countries and as a hospital ship. Heck, she could even be converted into an LSI(L). I also have plans to convert the British merchant MV Gran into a German AMC. But, I would be very excited at the prospect of seeing some of the following produced:
I did some research and some good candidates for consideration would be as follows:
British:
HMS Otranto - an Orient Steam Navigation Company passenger/mail carrier, she saw extensive service in WW1 and fought in the Battle of Coronel. She also had four sisters (Otway, Osterley, Orsova, and Orvieto), all of whom were pressed into service in various roles.
HMS Rawalpindi - a P&O Steam Navigation company ocean liner before the war, she and her three sisters (Raiputana, Ranchi and Ranpura) were immediately converted into AMC's, with Rawalpindi being sunk by Scharnhorst and Gneisenau 11/3/39, Raiputana was sunk 4/13/41, Ranchi converted to a troopship in 1943, and Ranpura converted to a repair ship in 1944.
HMS Jervis Bay - an Australian Commonwealth Line passenger-cargo liner before the war, she and two of her four sisters (Esperance Bay (originally named Hobsons Bay) and Moreton Bay) were converted into AMC's in 1940. Jervis Bay had the great misfortune of acting as sole escort for convoy HX84 when it was discovered by the pocket battleship Admiral Scheer on 11/5/40. There are a couple of great new books about the Jervis Bay out right now. The other two were converted into troopships in 1941. I don't know why Largs Bay and Arawa (originally named Esperance Bay) were not converted.
Collier (WWI) - any would be welcome
Tanker (WWII) - need some for my convoy battles - they were always an important prize
Doxford class freighter (WWII) - over 80 were built - the classic early war freighter, and could also be used to convert into a German AMC
Coastal Freighter (WWI or WWII) - great for the coastal convoys that were the mainstay of the Battle of the Atlantic in the first years of the war
Mid-sized troopship (WWII) - any will do, need to represent the many troop convoys that the Germans so desperately hunted
Glen class LSI(L) (WWII) - important for all the invasion fleets
German:
Atlantis - the most successful AMC, she sank or captured 22 ships totalling 145,697 tons until finally engaged by HMS Devonshire on 11/22/41.
Pinquin - the second most successful AMC, she sank or captured 17 ships plus an entire Norwegian whaling fleet (11 ships) totaling 136,551 tons until she was sunk by HMS Cornwall on 5/8/41.
Kormoran - she sank 11 ships before she was engaged by HMAS Sydney and both sank in the ensuing battle.
Thor - sank 11 ships and did battle with three different British AMC's.
French:
Commadante Teste - aviation transport located at Mers-el-Kébir with the French battle fleet during the British raid
American:
T2 tanker - important for convoy battles and supply in WWII
Mid-sized troopship - any of the presidents or generals will do
Other than that there is a good selection for the US
Japan:
Tankers - they were vital to the war effort for the Japanese - lots of scenarios around trying to intercept them
Freighter - any will do
Italian:
Small Freighter
Medium Freighter
Large fast Freighter
Small-Medium Tanker
Medium troopship
These are vital to the resupply of the DAK, so many good scenarios and reasons for fleet actions to take place in campaign games if these ships are available.
Again, I'd be happy to see even just one of these be produced.
Chris
At the same time I recognize GHQ's limited production capacity vis-a-vis everything we would like produced by them. So I would be pleased if they would allocate some of the resource they have for naval construction to include one or two of these non-combatant types per year - at least until we have some good representation. As it is now, I am very willing to take the Japanese maru and use her as a British AMC, a troop transport for all countries and as a hospital ship. Heck, she could even be converted into an LSI(L). I also have plans to convert the British merchant MV Gran into a German AMC. But, I would be very excited at the prospect of seeing some of the following produced:
I did some research and some good candidates for consideration would be as follows:
British:
HMS Otranto - an Orient Steam Navigation Company passenger/mail carrier, she saw extensive service in WW1 and fought in the Battle of Coronel. She also had four sisters (Otway, Osterley, Orsova, and Orvieto), all of whom were pressed into service in various roles.
HMS Rawalpindi - a P&O Steam Navigation company ocean liner before the war, she and her three sisters (Raiputana, Ranchi and Ranpura) were immediately converted into AMC's, with Rawalpindi being sunk by Scharnhorst and Gneisenau 11/3/39, Raiputana was sunk 4/13/41, Ranchi converted to a troopship in 1943, and Ranpura converted to a repair ship in 1944.
HMS Jervis Bay - an Australian Commonwealth Line passenger-cargo liner before the war, she and two of her four sisters (Esperance Bay (originally named Hobsons Bay) and Moreton Bay) were converted into AMC's in 1940. Jervis Bay had the great misfortune of acting as sole escort for convoy HX84 when it was discovered by the pocket battleship Admiral Scheer on 11/5/40. There are a couple of great new books about the Jervis Bay out right now. The other two were converted into troopships in 1941. I don't know why Largs Bay and Arawa (originally named Esperance Bay) were not converted.
Collier (WWI) - any would be welcome
Tanker (WWII) - need some for my convoy battles - they were always an important prize
Doxford class freighter (WWII) - over 80 were built - the classic early war freighter, and could also be used to convert into a German AMC
Coastal Freighter (WWI or WWII) - great for the coastal convoys that were the mainstay of the Battle of the Atlantic in the first years of the war
Mid-sized troopship (WWII) - any will do, need to represent the many troop convoys that the Germans so desperately hunted
Glen class LSI(L) (WWII) - important for all the invasion fleets
German:
Atlantis - the most successful AMC, she sank or captured 22 ships totalling 145,697 tons until finally engaged by HMS Devonshire on 11/22/41.
Pinquin - the second most successful AMC, she sank or captured 17 ships plus an entire Norwegian whaling fleet (11 ships) totaling 136,551 tons until she was sunk by HMS Cornwall on 5/8/41.
Kormoran - she sank 11 ships before she was engaged by HMAS Sydney and both sank in the ensuing battle.
Thor - sank 11 ships and did battle with three different British AMC's.
French:
Commadante Teste - aviation transport located at Mers-el-Kébir with the French battle fleet during the British raid
American:
T2 tanker - important for convoy battles and supply in WWII
Mid-sized troopship - any of the presidents or generals will do
Other than that there is a good selection for the US
Japan:
Tankers - they were vital to the war effort for the Japanese - lots of scenarios around trying to intercept them
Freighter - any will do
Italian:
Small Freighter
Medium Freighter
Large fast Freighter
Small-Medium Tanker
Medium troopship
These are vital to the resupply of the DAK, so many good scenarios and reasons for fleet actions to take place in campaign games if these ships are available.
Again, I'd be happy to see even just one of these be produced.
Chris
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Donald M. Scheef
- E5
- Posts: 1629
- Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2006 2:24 am
- Location: Waukegan, Illinois USA
I agree with many of the ships listed in the preceding postings. However, I would put my efforts into lobbying for those that are not produced by any other manufacturers. Although I prefer GHQ’s castings, there are good reasons to avoid duplication.
- With so many unmodelled commercial ships, why not produce these?
- I have already purchased some of the listed ships from other manufacturers. I would be reluctant to spend more money to purchase a GHQ version when I already have an acceptable, if not great version in my collection.
- With direct competition from another manufacturer, there is less income potential for GHQ; therefore, less reason to produce it.
Dobbin, Dixie, Pyro, Shasta, C2 cargo, C3 cargo, Hog Islander cargo, Terror, Kanawha, Ramapo, Suamico, Hog Islander transport, Vestal, Vulcan, Holland, Fulton, Pelias, Tangier, Bird class, Hikawa Maru, and Rawalpindi are all produced in 1/2400 metal models by at least one other manufacturer. For VC2 types, not only do several other manufacturers make one, but GHQ USN81 is a VC2-S-AP5 hull. Leaving off the landing craft makes a perfectly good Victory ship.
(By the way, in the initial list Oglala, Terror and Okinoshima are mine layers but have the identifier AM. In the USN classification system, AM is a minesweeper. Minelayers are identified by CM. When the classification system was started, several of the minelayers were obsolete cruisers; therefore, Cruiser Minelayer. The same designator was used for all minelayers, even those that had no resemblance to cruisers.)
Langley, Maidstone, Okinoshima, Chogei, Kamikawa Maru, Komet, Atlantis, and Jervis Bay are made in 1/2400 resin. For these, I would like to have a higher quality metal model.
This leaves Solace, Haven, Oglala, Medusa, Currituck, Forts, Asashi Maru, Aden Maru, Somedono Maru, Lyons Maru, Heian Maru, Aikoku Maru, Notoro (not Notoro Maru), Akashi, Rio De Janeiro Maru, Pinguin, Kormoran, Michel, Thor, Widder, Orion, Stier, Op Tin Noort, and Otranto from the list with no models.
Of these, the ships I most want to have modeled are the purpose-built ships such as Currituck and those that were involved in famous combats – the German raiders and Otranto.
I really like the suggestion that GHQ produce one or two of the auxiliary types per year. Recently, they seem to have been putting out about a dozen Micronauts per year. Perhaps we should lobby for an annual program such as three or four WWII combat ships (there are still decades of unmodelled ships at this rate), three or four WWI or pre-Dreadnought ships, two modern (i.e., post-1950) ships and three or four commercial/auxiliary ships. My favorite two would be AP-23, West Point and AMC Otranto.
By the way, I have started work on WW II era commercial ships list in the Comprehensive Micronauts Wish thread. With over 6000 ocean-going ships in commercial service at the start of the war, plus massive wartime building programs in the US and UK, compressing this to reasonable size will be quite a job. There is already a posting for military auxiliaries of WW II.
Don Scheef
- With so many unmodelled commercial ships, why not produce these?
- I have already purchased some of the listed ships from other manufacturers. I would be reluctant to spend more money to purchase a GHQ version when I already have an acceptable, if not great version in my collection.
- With direct competition from another manufacturer, there is less income potential for GHQ; therefore, less reason to produce it.
Dobbin, Dixie, Pyro, Shasta, C2 cargo, C3 cargo, Hog Islander cargo, Terror, Kanawha, Ramapo, Suamico, Hog Islander transport, Vestal, Vulcan, Holland, Fulton, Pelias, Tangier, Bird class, Hikawa Maru, and Rawalpindi are all produced in 1/2400 metal models by at least one other manufacturer. For VC2 types, not only do several other manufacturers make one, but GHQ USN81 is a VC2-S-AP5 hull. Leaving off the landing craft makes a perfectly good Victory ship.
(By the way, in the initial list Oglala, Terror and Okinoshima are mine layers but have the identifier AM. In the USN classification system, AM is a minesweeper. Minelayers are identified by CM. When the classification system was started, several of the minelayers were obsolete cruisers; therefore, Cruiser Minelayer. The same designator was used for all minelayers, even those that had no resemblance to cruisers.)
Langley, Maidstone, Okinoshima, Chogei, Kamikawa Maru, Komet, Atlantis, and Jervis Bay are made in 1/2400 resin. For these, I would like to have a higher quality metal model.
This leaves Solace, Haven, Oglala, Medusa, Currituck, Forts, Asashi Maru, Aden Maru, Somedono Maru, Lyons Maru, Heian Maru, Aikoku Maru, Notoro (not Notoro Maru), Akashi, Rio De Janeiro Maru, Pinguin, Kormoran, Michel, Thor, Widder, Orion, Stier, Op Tin Noort, and Otranto from the list with no models.
Of these, the ships I most want to have modeled are the purpose-built ships such as Currituck and those that were involved in famous combats – the German raiders and Otranto.
I really like the suggestion that GHQ produce one or two of the auxiliary types per year. Recently, they seem to have been putting out about a dozen Micronauts per year. Perhaps we should lobby for an annual program such as three or four WWII combat ships (there are still decades of unmodelled ships at this rate), three or four WWI or pre-Dreadnought ships, two modern (i.e., post-1950) ships and three or four commercial/auxiliary ships. My favorite two would be AP-23, West Point and AMC Otranto.
By the way, I have started work on WW II era commercial ships list in the Comprehensive Micronauts Wish thread. With over 6000 ocean-going ships in commercial service at the start of the war, plus massive wartime building programs in the US and UK, compressing this to reasonable size will be quite a job. There is already a posting for military auxiliaries of WW II.
Don Scheef
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IRISH
Don,
Thanks for the corrections on the CM and the Maru. I have corrected them.
I always stick maru on the end of the Notoro, bad habit I guess. I checked your posting and am sorry for dupilicating it. I agree that there are other manufacturers who have done some of them, but then alot are done by more than one. I have been down right spoiled by GHQs quality and though I have the Dobbins, Whitney, Utah and Pyro which are OK I would like to be able to have a complete GHQ Pearl Harbor set up which your suggestion on the Utah would be fully supported by me. I would hope also for the old CM Baltimore, but that would wait until the folks at GHQ decide to do the Spanish War Pre-dreadnoughts. I would also like to see the AG Sumner as well, but thats a far hope.
I like the thinking of both you and Chris about seeing if GHQ would maybe do 2 auxiliaries a year, great idea I hope they will consider it. I have considered using the Montrose to model a Victory, so I may very well do that. I would like you, like to see the Lions, Vanguard, Soviets, Japanese and French projected BBs and BCs. The West Point would be a nice US conter to the QE.
Best regards,
William
Thanks for the corrections on the CM and the Maru. I have corrected them.
I always stick maru on the end of the Notoro, bad habit I guess. I checked your posting and am sorry for dupilicating it. I agree that there are other manufacturers who have done some of them, but then alot are done by more than one. I have been down right spoiled by GHQs quality and though I have the Dobbins, Whitney, Utah and Pyro which are OK I would like to be able to have a complete GHQ Pearl Harbor set up which your suggestion on the Utah would be fully supported by me. I would hope also for the old CM Baltimore, but that would wait until the folks at GHQ decide to do the Spanish War Pre-dreadnoughts. I would also like to see the AG Sumner as well, but thats a far hope.
I like the thinking of both you and Chris about seeing if GHQ would maybe do 2 auxiliaries a year, great idea I hope they will consider it. I have considered using the Montrose to model a Victory, so I may very well do that. I would like you, like to see the Lions, Vanguard, Soviets, Japanese and French projected BBs and BCs. The West Point would be a nice US conter to the QE.
Best regards,
William
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Donald M. Scheef
- E5
- Posts: 1629
- Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2006 2:24 am
- Location: Waukegan, Illinois USA
As far as West Point being a counter to QE; West Point (ex-America) was the best US transport of the era, but couldn't hold a candle to QE (or Queen Mary, Normandie, Bremer, Rex, etc.).
West Point - 35 400 tons, 723' long, 24 kt, troop capacity 8175
Queen Elizabeth - 83 673 tons, 987' long, averaged > 30 kts several times on trans-Atlantic crossings, troop capacity > 10 000
Queen Mary - 80 774 tons, 1019' long, also averaged > 30 kts on a trans-Atlantic corssing, carried over 15 000 troops in one crossing
Normandie - 83 423 tons, 1029' long, 32 kts, never used as a troop transport, but could easily have carried over 10 000
Bremer - 56 390 tons, 939' long, averaged > 28 kt on at least one trans-Atlantic crossing, never used as a troop transport, but could have carried over 10 000
Rex - 51 062 tons, 880' long, averaged > 29 kt on at least one trans-Atlantic crossing, never used as a troop transport, but could have carried > 1000
I would truly like to have a good model of West Point, but she was definitely a second-tier liner by international standards. Even the post-war United States was a relatively small ship compared to the Queens. She was fantastically fast, however.
With respect to Notoro, all Japanese commercial ships are identified by 'Maru.' When a commercial ship is requisitioned for military use, it retains the Maru designation. On the other hand, a ship built for military use, even if it is basically a commercial design, is not a Maru. This is the case with Notoro. For another example, the ship Rio de Janero was purchased by a Japanese shipping company and became Rio de Janero Maru. Then, the IJN took over the ship as an armed merchant cruiser. Even though it was an armed ship with a military crew, it was still Rio de Janero Maru.
Don Scheef
West Point - 35 400 tons, 723' long, 24 kt, troop capacity 8175
Queen Elizabeth - 83 673 tons, 987' long, averaged > 30 kts several times on trans-Atlantic crossings, troop capacity > 10 000
Queen Mary - 80 774 tons, 1019' long, also averaged > 30 kts on a trans-Atlantic corssing, carried over 15 000 troops in one crossing
Normandie - 83 423 tons, 1029' long, 32 kts, never used as a troop transport, but could easily have carried over 10 000
Bremer - 56 390 tons, 939' long, averaged > 28 kt on at least one trans-Atlantic crossing, never used as a troop transport, but could have carried over 10 000
Rex - 51 062 tons, 880' long, averaged > 29 kt on at least one trans-Atlantic crossing, never used as a troop transport, but could have carried > 1000
I would truly like to have a good model of West Point, but she was definitely a second-tier liner by international standards. Even the post-war United States was a relatively small ship compared to the Queens. She was fantastically fast, however.
With respect to Notoro, all Japanese commercial ships are identified by 'Maru.' When a commercial ship is requisitioned for military use, it retains the Maru designation. On the other hand, a ship built for military use, even if it is basically a commercial design, is not a Maru. This is the case with Notoro. For another example, the ship Rio de Janero was purchased by a Japanese shipping company and became Rio de Janero Maru. Then, the IJN took over the ship as an armed merchant cruiser. Even though it was an armed ship with a military crew, it was still Rio de Janero Maru.
Don Scheef
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IRISH
West Point and others
Don,
I argee fully about the capacities. The West Point would be a nice U.S. counter only in the apsects of a large US Transport. Thank you for the information.
I have always added to "Maru" to Notoro even though I know the naming system.
I would also like to see GHQ further the British line extended as well as the Lion, I would like to see the carriers, DDs and cruisers expanded too
I have suggested before but I think seeing some group releases like:
1. HMS Argus, IJN Hosho and the USN Langley
2. HMS Unicorn, IJN Chitose, USN Wright
3. HMS Malta, IJN Shinano, USN Midway
4. HMS Audacity, IJN Taiyo, USN Bogue
5. HMS Implacable, IJN Unyru
6. HMS Unicorn, IJN Ryuho
7. HMS Vindex, IJN Kaiyo, USN Sangamon
8. HMS Indomitable, IJN Katsuragi
9. HMS Majestic, IJN Shinyo
10. HMS Vanguard, IJN B64, GEN "P" Class
11. HMS Lion, IJN Super Yamato, FRN Clemenceau
12 SUN Sovyetskiy Soyuz, FRN Gascoigne
I would like to see a few more subs as well:
The early US subs and maybe a Dutch K class and the I 400s
I hope to see some of these some day including the Merchies and Auxs.
Bill
I argee fully about the capacities. The West Point would be a nice U.S. counter only in the apsects of a large US Transport. Thank you for the information.
I have always added to "Maru" to Notoro even though I know the naming system.
I would also like to see GHQ further the British line extended as well as the Lion, I would like to see the carriers, DDs and cruisers expanded too
I have suggested before but I think seeing some group releases like:
1. HMS Argus, IJN Hosho and the USN Langley
2. HMS Unicorn, IJN Chitose, USN Wright
3. HMS Malta, IJN Shinano, USN Midway
4. HMS Audacity, IJN Taiyo, USN Bogue
5. HMS Implacable, IJN Unyru
6. HMS Unicorn, IJN Ryuho
7. HMS Vindex, IJN Kaiyo, USN Sangamon
8. HMS Indomitable, IJN Katsuragi
9. HMS Majestic, IJN Shinyo
10. HMS Vanguard, IJN B64, GEN "P" Class
11. HMS Lion, IJN Super Yamato, FRN Clemenceau
12 SUN Sovyetskiy Soyuz, FRN Gascoigne
I would like to see a few more subs as well:
The early US subs and maybe a Dutch K class and the I 400s
I hope to see some of these some day including the Merchies and Auxs.
Bill