Russian horse drawn guns

[kiasutha]

Could anyone point me to some "online" photos or help with info on these?
I'm mainly interested in the limbers & number of horses usually used for the guns in infantry divisions; 45mm atg, 76mm inf.gun, and divisional guns like the ZIS-3 or old Schnieder-Putilof 76mm...
Non-German Axis stuff would help too.
I'm guessing the Polish gun team is a good stand-in for the old 76mm, and a bunch of eastern European Axis guns as well.
But what about the smaller guns? Did they use a limber similar to the "motorized" one in the GHQ 45mm atg pack?
I'm afraid horse-drawn WW2 is a new interest for me. Probably a lot of photos buried in my old books, but I hope you folks might help jump-start the project...
Thanks,
JR.

[Mk 1]

kiasutha contemplated:
Could anyone point me to some "online" photos or help with info on these?
I'm mainly interested in the limbers & number of horses usually used for the guns in
infantry divisions; 45mm atg, 76mm inf.gun, and divisional guns like the ZIS-3 or old
Schnieder-Putilof 76mm...
Non-German Axis stuff would help too.
I'm guessing the Polish gun team is a good stand-in for the old 76mm, and a bunch of
eastern European Axis guns as well.
But what about the smaller guns? Did they use a limber similar to the "motorized" one in
the GHQ 45mm atg pack?

Good questions. A subject of interest for me in my micro-armor troops for some time.

Here is what I've found out in my research (which is admittedly rather thin -- not much
more than google-fu and a bit of reading...)

The preferred approach for the Soviets was a 6-horse limber. If you look at proper pre-
war TOEs (where you can find them) you'll see this. The Soviets tended towards a
single limber, not a dual rig as was used on many other nations. Much of the gun crew
would ride the horses as they pulled, as the limber itself would only seat two or three
crewmen.

After the war started (and who knows - maybe before the war in reality rather than in
published pictures), a 6-horse limber was a luxury that was not afforded to most light
guns. 2-horse limbers became reasonably common.

The limber that was used with the Komsomolyets prime mover was also used in a horse-
drawn configuration. The Soviets were always ready to use any useful design for
multiple purposes. Older horse-only limbers had traditional-looking wagon wheels. More
modern limbers, that could do service for either horse- or mechanized-drawing, used
truck wheels with pneumatic tires.

This approach does not seem unique to the Soviets. Looks like many Eastern militaries
followed the same approach.


This link shows 6- and 2-horse Polish limbers.





These pics show some of my kit-bashed Soviet limbers coming under German artillery
fire and withdrawing after dropping off their charges during a game con battle with
Thunder and CG Erickson (who post on this board on occasion).

[kiasutha]

Mk-1:
Very helpful & confirms some of what I was thinking.
Now all I need is a bunch of spare Komsomolets limbers...
Long ago I made some up from spare Heroics 25#limbers, & have even used surplus ACW on occasion .
May I ask the source of the wagons in your photos; they look like the "other guys"; I'm guessing? I haven't seen their products in a lot of years, exept on the web.
I've also come across references to one-horse hitches on light guns in Finland at least.
Recently, Bachuss (UK) have started a Franco/Prussian War range, and I've wondered if the limbers from that might also be useful.
I tried ordering some from their US rep., but found them basically "not currently trading".
Perhaps some of our British members could comment?
Again; thanks!
JR.