WWII Micro Armour: The Game - Questions
Moderators: dnichols, GHQ, Mk 1
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General Retreat
- Posts: 65
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- Location: North of Dayton, Ohio
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General Retreat
- Posts: 65
- Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2011 6:02 am
- Location: North of Dayton, Ohio
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dougeagle
- E5
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- Location: Northern Alberta
Yeah...I totally forgot about this. It's been awhile since I have actually used the GHQ rules. Last time I played it, I found that using mortars to try and suppress AFV was useless, but man I tell ya...I was sure laying waste to them infantry...when it landed on target of coarse. In the end, I still lost, but not as bad either.dougeagle: The reason one would attack armored units with mortars, despite their having a low probability to inflict much lasting or deadly effects is that per the CRT If the attacker is Artillery or Support, treat 'No Effect' as 'Suppressed'. So if your mortars fire directly or indirectly and don't drift off target or other artillery firing indirectly doesn't drift off target, their fire suppresses that King Tiger platoon that is trying to make you have a bad day. For that matter anything in the impact zone (where ever it lands) is suppressed, whether the fire was on target or not.
However, I see what you mean about your Kitty and suppressing it...makes sense.
Doug
A goal is not always meant to be reached, it often serves simply as something to aim at.
Bruce Lee
A goal is not always meant to be reached, it often serves simply as something to aim at.
Bruce Lee
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General Retreat
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- Location: North of Dayton, Ohio
Artillery Questions
Would you say the optional "Hot Shot†rule applies to artillery?
Question about the Forward Observer: Since this unit has to see the target (or targeted spot) to plot, must it continue to see the target spot through the fall of shot? Bound up with this question is the required cohesion roll when the shot is supposed to fall (3. Joint Artillery Phase). Is the cohesion roll affected by terrain as Standard Fire’s cohesion roll is? Put another way, is it a cohesion for the artillery unit alone or the FO? If the FO, this implies the FO has to still be able to see the target. If the FO’s view is blocked before its turn, say by smoke, does the shot not fall? If after falling the view is blocked, does fire cease? Must the FO remain in non-movement posture throughout?
Question about the Forward Observer: Since this unit has to see the target (or targeted spot) to plot, must it continue to see the target spot through the fall of shot? Bound up with this question is the required cohesion roll when the shot is supposed to fall (3. Joint Artillery Phase). Is the cohesion roll affected by terrain as Standard Fire’s cohesion roll is? Put another way, is it a cohesion for the artillery unit alone or the FO? If the FO, this implies the FO has to still be able to see the target. If the FO’s view is blocked before its turn, say by smoke, does the shot not fall? If after falling the view is blocked, does fire cease? Must the FO remain in non-movement posture throughout?
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RedLeif
- E5
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hot shot applied to Arty: yes
basics of indirect arty (7.8 +):
turn X: an FO plots a fire mission, for a position it has a clear line of site to, for an artillery fire mission on turn X+1 (unless you're using optional rules) by rolling a successful cohesion roll. This roll is NOT modified by the terrain. The FO is spotting and arty crews are firing indirectly to a set of coordinates - they dial the gun in to a set of numbers and pull the lanyard. The FO is not calling the fire in on a unit but rather a grid coordinate. IF you can 'see' a line of trees you can fire on it. You can not see behind the first 1" of trees as they block line of site so your FO can't plot it.
So does the FO have to see the barrage fall, in game terms, no. If the FO can no longer see the barrage fall (due to something like smoke getting in the way) is it canceled before arriving: no, it still lands (if all cohesion rolls for the arty succeed). I would explain this as the arty unit fired its registration rounds during turn X (when the FO was calling it in). If the FO failed the roll presumably it didn't see the registration rounds and didn't confirm the mission). also the sequence of play is such that the smoke
It's the arty battery (stand) that is making the arrival and deviation cohesion rolls, not the FO (7.8.3). It's the arty stand that makes those rolls on the turn of arrival of the mission see the indirect fire procedure at the back of the book.
regards,
RedLeif
basics of indirect arty (7.8 +):
turn X: an FO plots a fire mission, for a position it has a clear line of site to, for an artillery fire mission on turn X+1 (unless you're using optional rules) by rolling a successful cohesion roll. This roll is NOT modified by the terrain. The FO is spotting and arty crews are firing indirectly to a set of coordinates - they dial the gun in to a set of numbers and pull the lanyard. The FO is not calling the fire in on a unit but rather a grid coordinate. IF you can 'see' a line of trees you can fire on it. You can not see behind the first 1" of trees as they block line of site so your FO can't plot it.
So does the FO have to see the barrage fall, in game terms, no. If the FO can no longer see the barrage fall (due to something like smoke getting in the way) is it canceled before arriving: no, it still lands (if all cohesion rolls for the arty succeed). I would explain this as the arty unit fired its registration rounds during turn X (when the FO was calling it in). If the FO failed the roll presumably it didn't see the registration rounds and didn't confirm the mission). also the sequence of play is such that the smoke
It's the arty battery (stand) that is making the arrival and deviation cohesion rolls, not the FO (7.8.3). It's the arty stand that makes those rolls on the turn of arrival of the mission see the indirect fire procedure at the back of the book.
regards,
RedLeif
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General Retreat
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I see the reasonableness of your take on it.
But now I noticed my answer on page 128 in the Indirect Fire Procedure "card." Step 2--clearly in the firing turn--says "roll for cohesion for each firing stand, modified for terrain." Clearly implied is the FO's constant observation. Would also seem to mean blocked view or dead FO means no fire.
What do others think?
But now I noticed my answer on page 128 in the Indirect Fire Procedure "card." Step 2--clearly in the firing turn--says "roll for cohesion for each firing stand, modified for terrain." Clearly implied is the FO's constant observation. Would also seem to mean blocked view or dead FO means no fire.
What do others think?
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RedLeif
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Yup, you're right. my bad. The FO needn't roll cohesion to plot the fire, it must be stationary and be able to trace a line of site to the point on the turn of plot.
And, per the procedure, the arty arrival roll, and crt roll, is subject to adjustment by the target location's terrain.
As to your question about the FO seeing the target during the turn of the artillery attack I focused here:
On page 9, rule 7.8 says “these stands [FO’s] must have a clear line of site to the potential target during the plot phase and my not be in the movement posture. If they are eliminated at any point during the turn, the plot is canceled.â€
Does the FO have to be able to see the target during the turn of arrival? I’d answer “no†as it doesn’t say this in the rules anywhere. All of the references to the cohesion rolls are for the firing arty stand, not the FO. But the last sentence of the quote above might be misinterpreted that way. I interpret that sentence to mean ‘if the FO is eliminated before the end of the turn of the plot, the plot is canceled'. This would be rare though.
The only way I can see an FO getting eliminated prior to the end of the turn (as the plot phase comes after arty fire and direct fire) is getting close assaulted or overrun (which happen in the movement phase). Since the FO can not plot when in the movement posture the FO can’t move into a barrage or be fired at in op-fire so that really only leaves overruns and close assaults to eliminate it.
I'd like to see if any of the moderators have input on this.
thanks
RedLeif
And, per the procedure, the arty arrival roll, and crt roll, is subject to adjustment by the target location's terrain.
As to your question about the FO seeing the target during the turn of the artillery attack I focused here:
On page 9, rule 7.8 says “these stands [FO’s] must have a clear line of site to the potential target during the plot phase and my not be in the movement posture. If they are eliminated at any point during the turn, the plot is canceled.â€
Does the FO have to be able to see the target during the turn of arrival? I’d answer “no†as it doesn’t say this in the rules anywhere. All of the references to the cohesion rolls are for the firing arty stand, not the FO. But the last sentence of the quote above might be misinterpreted that way. I interpret that sentence to mean ‘if the FO is eliminated before the end of the turn of the plot, the plot is canceled'. This would be rare though.
The only way I can see an FO getting eliminated prior to the end of the turn (as the plot phase comes after arty fire and direct fire) is getting close assaulted or overrun (which happen in the movement phase). Since the FO can not plot when in the movement posture the FO can’t move into a barrage or be fired at in op-fire so that really only leaves overruns and close assaults to eliminate it.
I'd like to see if any of the moderators have input on this.
thanks
RedLeif