Micro Armor Tentage

rdenman62 · Post by **rdenman62** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:58 am

Redleg here's a link to a post I posted a while back on this forum and some pictures for the tent extension on a M577 TOC....
http://www.ghqmodels.com/forum/viewtopi ... =toc#23987
Pretty sure I used tissue paper covered in white glue(elmers) then as it stared to dry a little yet was still pliable I formed it into a tent.....

paul · Post by **paul** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 2:57 am

Panzer,

I believe it was 15. Three platoons of 4 and command track and two engineers. It has been 28 years and my years in the Army mix in. If Clancy is not considering the engineer/repairs tracks then it would be 13.

Regards,

Paul

panzergator · Post by **panzergator** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 4:48 am

Paul, thanks. That makes sense. I figured the standard 4 per platoon, 2 command tracks and a maintenance/recovery track.

I guess we aren't that far apart - I left active 3 years before you did.

panzergator · Post by **panzergator** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 8:51 pm

Redleg, apologies for distracting your thread regarding the M577 track extension for other subjects. I am considering carving or sculpting a mold and using white glue-soaked tissue paper over it. It will be a few weeks before I can get to it. I recently visited the dowel section at Home Depot and found some square pieces that might work

Paul, I've had a look at the Clancy book on Marines and it has been very helpful. I will continue to mount my Marines in the LAV - crew of three plus 6 dismounts, 4 vehicles per platoon, 3 platoons per company.

panzergator · Post by **panzergator** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:56 am

Redleg,

There is an interesting example of a track extension to be viewed in Microarmor Mayhem (just search on it) in The Netherlands section. It's off the back end of a YPR 765, made of brass wire and foil. Not a bad effort. Looks worth a try.

redleg · Post by **redleg** » Fri Dec 04, 2015 7:48 am

Thanks for the tentage tips guys! I'll keep experimenting and looking. For some reason the name Sosna comes to mind as someone who had produced them years ago...maybe from Poland? Or maybe my memory is going to hell. That's been happening more and more lately. Wait...what were we talking about?

redleg · Post by **redleg** » Mon Jan 18, 2016 8:51 am

I thought Iâ€™d share my solution to the tent extension dilemma. I made a pretty basic template on powerpoint ad then I print it, cut it out, and fold it into the correct shape. A little trim and some paint and itâ€™s the right basic shape, though lacking in detail. Fortunately I donâ€™t have much skill in painting and modeling so these tents fit right in with my modern force. I have some M577s with the ramp down and I cut the paper away so that the track can back right in.

-Mike
[/img]http://i.imgur.com/TAPYlPE.jpg[/img]

[/img]http://i.imgur.com/293pPoa.jpg[/img]

[/img]http://i.imgur.com/1FaJDOo.jpg[/img]

Mk 1 · Post by **Mk 1** » Mon Jan 18, 2016 2:07 pm

redleg wrote:I thought Iâ€™d share my solution to the tent extension dilemma.
...

How's that? Better?

CDP · Post by **CDP** » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:27 pm

That looks excellent.

Spent enough time putting them up & down again but never bothered to learn how big they are. Would any one have the correct dimensions of the real thing?

rdenman62 · Post by **rdenman62** » Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:15 am

This site may help
http://www.tentnet.org/tentnet/basecamp/MCPS/mcps.htm

rdenman62 · Post by **rdenman62** » Wed Jan 20, 2016 1:26 am

I believe they were 11'x11'x8'

redleg · Post by **redleg** » Wed Jan 20, 2016 10:03 am

Thanks Mark!

Bad_Syntax · Post by **Bad_Syntax** » Wed Jan 20, 2016 10:19 am

In Germany, 4-12 Infantry, in 94-97, I was in S-3 (well most of that time). I setup a LOT of TOCs, and lived in them for large periods of time.

Anyway, first of all the TOC was compromised of the M577 from S-2, S-3, and FDC, each with a GP Medium tent. Inside of that would be 3 tables setup, 2 for the S-3 comms and 1 for S-2 comms, 1 for arty radios, maybe another for maps but those usually hung up on the wall of the tent. The Assistant S-3 or XO was usually in the TOC, with his Bradley outside. The Commander and his bradley were also often out there, depending on the commander and if he preferred to lead from his HMMWV, or M2.

There was also a "jump toc", or another toc that could take over if we got compromised. I believe this was usually S-1/S-2 assets, though it was smaller and less capable. It was always a few km away. Often the S-3 Air was there as well, or he may have been in the primary TOC, and he had a HMMWV.

We could break down in about 15 minutes, and setup in 30, though we also had to setup generators, larger antenna, and other stuff that'd take a bit longer. If we knew we'd be there a while we'd eventually setup camo nets, defensive/fighting positions, latrine, etc.

Each had a GP Medium tent (http://gcmini.mybigcommerce.com/gp-medi ... 285sce002/) that was stored, well, internally on top of other junk.

At least in our battalion, the S-2 and S-3 tracks would park near each other, usually one to 90 degrees. The FDC toc farther out. All would setup the GP Medium tents, so there would be 3 tents up, sometimes 4. The M577's would have their ramps down, and all the operations would be inside the tents (Everybody was too tall to stand in the back of the M577, so it was just used for junk, and no, could not be effectively used while moving).

So a TOC would be:
3xM577
3-4xGP Medium
External generator for power, not sure why we never used the ones on the M577s
External antenna if we knew we'd be there a while, helps with comms
2 to 4 HMMWV (S-3/XO, often the CSM's, and the S-3 NCOIC)
0 to 2 Bradley, though they may just be within a km or so
In combat, they'd typically have an infantry platoon in a defensive perimeter
It was NEVER 1 or 2 tracks, if it wasn't all 3, it wasn't a TOC and setup was pointless.

Though my memories are a bit rusty, I can probably help answer questions about S-3 operations within an MIB in the early 90s. I don't think armor battalions were much different, as we worked with them often (we *always* did things with 2 mech co and 1 armor co, never 3 mech co)

I was also in S-3 in the 11th ACR at NTC, though my experience there is pretty useless for simulations, though we did kinda half-** CENSORED ** act like ruskies. I blew up a few enemy TOCs, but wasn't paying attention to their layout at the time

My biggest regret about my military service, aside from getting broke and a break in service, was that I didn't take a LOT more pictures. When you are in its no big deal, when you are out and into military equipment those pictures are far better than your memory!

Here are some pics I found of TOCs in various states:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2709/4086 ... z.jpg?zz=1
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ ... ge1366.gif
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/73 ... 7c4c43.jpg
http://www.black-knights-kill.com/files ... pnell1.jpg

Though I don't think I ever saw it, I believe the medics had a setup too:
http://www.angelfire.com/games2/peanuts ... Set_Up.jpg

I couldn't find a single good picture of what the inside looks like, all the ones I had put in floors/walls, which never happened in Germany (we did get hay a few times to help with the mud).

Bad_Syntax · Post by **Bad_Syntax** » Wed Jan 20, 2016 10:22 am

Oh, and we NEVER used that "modular command post thing".

It was a generic GP Medium, maybe setup a bit short, but it was always a GP Medium. Not enough room in those other things.

At least 3-4 tables in there, all like 3' x 6', 5-10 people in there at once. Plus maps, a coffee machine, a few chairs, MREs, duffle bags, weapons, etc, etc. Those little MCPS things simply didn't cut it.

panzergator · Post by **panzergator** » Tue Feb 02, 2016 5:55 am

Bad_Syntax,

Your command groups must have gotten awfully bloated to require both track extensions AND a GP Medium tent. WAAAAY before the new modular system, I served in two battalions and two brigade headquarters in Europe and one each in the US ('70s and early '80s. The 577s with track extensions were always more than adequate. Usually three to four canvas extensions linked together. We usually put two tracks side by side, then overlapped the two sides that were side by side and zipped in the others. More than enough room. Once, we even dug the tracks in to roof-top level at Fort Polk one summer, much to everyone's misery. There was an Israeli lieutenant colonel in my Armor Advanced Course class who told us our 4-6 M577 "extension palaces" would never survive in combat against the Russians. With that in mind, I got permission to spread the tracks out over a little knoll and hook 'em in by wire to try to reduce the heat signature and make us less than a target. It worked well except for briefings, but the commander at the time was not inclined to hold those anyway. He was always out talking to his commanders on the ground and only checked in with us when he needed an update. Everything else was frago.

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