Canada (Imagi-Nation)

chrisswim · Post by **chrisswim** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 5:40 am

Coded broadcast... Thule, Greenland
Prepare for Operation: Plan A, execute.
Task Force East, call up your reserves. Task Force West is preparing, build up in the region. The ships that went on northern Atlantic Naval Wargames have returned to Nuuk Naval Base. 4 SSGN (SOC) have entered harbor, 2 have departed. Air transports landed further east in Greenland.
. One question for your leadership, why are there 3-island nations that c......... break in transmission.....

MechCommander · Post by **MechCommander** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 6:10 am

Since we have too few M577s in our inventory, Battery HQ will consist of 1 M557 for FDC, and a MILCOTS Chevy truck for Battery ops, as for the 7 wheeled vehicles will be LAV IIIs to provide cover for Battery HQ. However the Battery will not be broken up into platoons.

The Centralized Ammo carrier section will function at the Battery Level.

I don't know whats going on in Greenland but it can't be good.

MechCommander · Post by **MechCommander** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 6:39 am

We got plenty of M35 Trucks we can use to carry Ammo for the guns, granted they have no Heavy Weapon Mounts, but its the best we can do.

Now as for the Heavy Mortars previously in the last few posts the Artillery regiments deployed the Mortars in as their own Squadrons attached to the main gun battery they provide decent cover for the heavy guns by firing ether Anti-personal rounds to handle large groups of charging infantry, to Smoke rounds to blanket the area to allow the artillery pieces time to escape.

panzergator · Post by **panzergator** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 6:55 am

Mortars wasted.

MechCommander · Post by **MechCommander** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 7:31 am

Well Mortars are considered a form of Arttilery weapons, so naturally they end up with Arttilery Regiments.

panzergator · Post by **panzergator** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 8:06 am

What is the range of your M109s? What is the range of your mortars? Why do you suppose the mortars are shorter ranged (hint: it is NOT to protect your artillery)? But you go ahead and proceed in your... lack of reading.

redleg · Post by **redleg** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 8:17 am

I can't speak for Canadian artillery or mortars, but in the US mortars are an infantry support weapon. The MOS for a mortar crewman is 11C - Indirect Fire Infantryman. They are an essential part of infantry and armor organizations, which is why I keep harping about them in the maneuver units. This is an old slide (from 20000 from Fort Sill - the artillery school. Clearly our doctrine is to assign mortars to infantry and armor companies and battalions, and leave the big guns and rockets to the artillery branch.

The New Canadian Army is your though. You can organize it however you want to, we're just trying to impart some wisdom and experience so that you'e not reinventing the wheel.

M35s are good for ammo, and the battery HQ will be good with M35s and light trucks or land rover-type vehicles.

If you have any questions about this stuff feel free to ask - I have all of my powerpoint presentations from Fort Sill that I can send you, and there are others on this forum with tons of experience and references.

If you still want to put your mortars in the howitzer batteries, is the idea that there is one set of crews and they choose between the howitzers and the mortars (I believe France has tried this) or do you want 8 fully manned howitzers AND 8 fully manned mortars?

MechCommander · Post by **MechCommander** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 9:42 am

Yes Both 8 fully manned M109s, and 8 fully manned 81mm Mortars.

As for the weapons maximum ranges
M109 Howitzer 18km.
L16 81mm Mortar 6km.

redleg · Post by **redleg** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 10:23 am

So are your 81mm mortars going to be mounted in an armored vehicle or in a light truck? If you go with an armored mortar carrier you will need an additional crewman for each mortar tube. For now I am assuming you want them in a truck.

If you have 8 howitzers AND 8 mortars in the same battery you will need to have separate FDCs, so we recommend making them part of the firing troops rather than part of the battery HQ. Also, you will need either 2 ammo sections or a big fat ammo section to handle 2 different types of ammo. We recommend 12 trucks for a big fat ammo section. Keep in mind that artillery ammo is not like a tank round where you have a single object to handle. Complete 155mm rounds have 3 components: projectile, propellant, and fuze. There are multiple types of each component.

BTW - range depends on type of projectile and type of propellant (not to mention atmospheric conditions, propellant temperature, tube wear, etc.) The range for a 155mm howitzer is closer to 30km when you're shooting RAP or BBDPICM.

MechCommander · Post by **MechCommander** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 10:59 am

The 81mm Mortars are placed in old M113A1 APCs as for the seperate FDC it will be done by a Iltis Command Car. 12 M35s will do for the Ammo section.

New Canada though does not have access to the RAP and BBDPICM Rounds.

7.62 · Post by **7.62** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 11:21 am

MechCommander · Post by **MechCommander** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 11:33 am

More likely in the hands of the KDF's army. Where did they find those old Vehicles?

panzergator · Post by **panzergator** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 9:39 pm

Mortars are a MANEUVER support weapon, found, at least, in British and US armor battalions as well as infantry battalions. They are there to respond quickly to the unit's immediate needs for indirect fire. The bigger GUNS of an artillery battery or battalion may not be available (there is usually a priority of support and your unit may not be it) or it may not be appropriate to use the bigger GUNS for a particular situation. Co-located with artillery batteries/battalions, their range makes them useless for supporting the maneuver units, unless your artillery batteries are closer to the front line than they should be, in which case your artillery crews should be well-drilled in direct fire procedures and protected by infantry and armor, ANOTHER waste of assets due to improper employment of your weapons.

Just info...

7.62 · Post by **7.62** » Sun Sep 01, 2019 10:37 pm

redleg · Post by **redleg** » Mon Sep 02, 2019 1:14 am

PG has a very good point about the ranges of the howitzers and mortars. It's your army though and you can put them together if you want to. That gives you a really fat SP artillery battery though at 123 personnel by my math.

Battery HQ: 20 dudes to include a commander, XO, first sergeant, battery ops center, gunnery sergeant, chief of firing battery, commo NCO, NBC NCO, Supply NCO, Armorer, etc.

Howitzer troop: 40 dudes to crew 8 M109 howitzers and an FDC. Plus 2 dudes for troop HQ.

Mortar Troop: 38 dudes to include troop HQ, 8 81mm mortar sections in APCs, and an FDC

Ammo troop: 25 dudes with 12 M35 trucks to haul ammo.

Is that how you want your SP batteries to look?